A political statement

The forum for general posting. Come join the madness. :)
Post Reply
Message
Author
User avatar
Beebs52
Queen of Wack
Posts: 14892
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:38 am
Location: Location.Location.Location

A political statement

#1 Post by Beebs52 » Fri Oct 19, 2018 4:51 pm

I have no probs with the lotto et al, but is anyone concerned that profiting from working for those entities is promoting poorer peeps' paychecks contributing to one's retirement funds?

Speaking theoretically of course.
Well, then

User avatar
littlebeast13
Dumbass
Posts: 31103
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:20 pm
Location: Between the Sterilite and the Farberware
Contact:

Re: A political statement

#2 Post by littlebeast13 » Fri Oct 19, 2018 8:39 pm

Beebs52 wrote:I have no probs with the lotto et al, but is anyone concerned that profiting from working for those entities is promoting poorer peeps' paychecks contributing to one's retirement funds?

Speaking theoretically of course.

The same could be said about my job. Every employed person has some kind of deal with the devil...

lb13
Thursday comics! Squirrel pictures! The link to my CafePress store! All kinds of fun stuff!!!!

Visit my Evil Squirrel blog here: http://evilsquirrelsnest.com

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 23177
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: A political statement

#3 Post by silverscreenselect » Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:10 am

Beebs52 wrote:I have no probs with the lotto et al, but is anyone concerned that profiting from working for those entities is promoting poorer peeps' paychecks contributing to one's retirement funds?

Speaking theoretically of course.
I have thought about that more than once, and I'm not fully comfortable with it. But the lottery here in Georgia paid over $1 billion for college and pre-k education last year and is helping to fund my grandchildren's college education (and indirectly my daughter's retirement, since the money she doesn't have to pay on their college goes to her own retirement funds).
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

User avatar
littlebeast13
Dumbass
Posts: 31103
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:20 pm
Location: Between the Sterilite and the Farberware
Contact:

Re: A political statement

#4 Post by littlebeast13 » Sat Oct 20, 2018 6:51 am

silverscreenselect wrote:
Beebs52 wrote:I have no probs with the lotto et al, but is anyone concerned that profiting from working for those entities is promoting poorer peeps' paychecks contributing to one's retirement funds?

Speaking theoretically of course.
I have thought about that more than once, and I'm not fully comfortable with it. But the lottery here in Georgia paid over $1 billion for college and pre-k education last year and is helping to fund my grandchildren's college education (and indirectly my daughter's retirement, since the money she doesn't have to pay on their college goes to her own retirement funds).

I have always heard that most states take advantage of the lottery proceeds being earmarked for education by redirecting equivalent chunks of the budget that would have gone towards education for other things.... or basically, the lottery proceeds are in reality going towards funding all kinds of other state projects and pork barrel stuff besides education. Whether or not that's really true, I don't know, but would be curious as to your experience on that (and coming from me, that's NOT meant to be a political observation)...

lb13
Thursday comics! Squirrel pictures! The link to my CafePress store! All kinds of fun stuff!!!!

Visit my Evil Squirrel blog here: http://evilsquirrelsnest.com

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 23177
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: A political statement

#5 Post by silverscreenselect » Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:24 am

littlebeast13 wrote: or basically, the lottery proceeds are in reality going towards funding all kinds of other state projects and pork barrel stuff besides education.
I can't speak for other states, but in Georgia, from day one, profits went to fund college scholarships for Georgia residents (later expanded, as revenue rose, to include pre-K programs). This was not a case of lottery money simply going into the general education fund (or the general revenue fund) and presumably replacing other money that would have been spent anyway, but a case of it going towards a brand new program that the state had never paid for before (and, without the lottery, probably never would have). It's the same as a special tax assessment that goes to pay for a particular highway construction, except that the lottery is voluntary. Last fiscal year, that was $1.1 billion (and will be more this year).
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

User avatar
Beebs52
Queen of Wack
Posts: 14892
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:38 am
Location: Location.Location.Location

Re: A political statement

#6 Post by Beebs52 » Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:46 am

Works for me.
Well, then

User avatar
BackInTex
Posts: 12780
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:43 pm
Location: In Texas of course!

Re: A political statement

#7 Post by BackInTex » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:03 am

silverscreenselect wrote:
littlebeast13 wrote: or basically, the lottery proceeds are in reality going towards funding all kinds of other state projects and pork barrel stuff besides education.
I can't speak for other states, but in Georgia, from day one, profits went to fund college scholarships for Georgia residents (later expanded, as revenue rose, to include pre-K programs). This was not a case of lottery money simply going into the general education fund (or the general revenue fund) and presumably replacing other money that would have been spent anyway, but a case of it going towards a brand new program that the state had never paid for before (and, without the lottery, probably never would have). It's the same as a special tax assessment that goes to pay for a particular highway construction, except that the lottery is voluntary. Last fiscal year, that was $1.1 billion (and will be more this year).
Unless there is an analysis that shows x% of state tax revenues going to education pre & post lottery is equal and that education funding is increased $ for $ by lottery proceeds it's all money manipulation (as I suspect it is in Texas).

I play the lottery, more than occasionally but less than regularly. My wife says "you better not" but I do it anyway. For this weeks $billion I bought $20 worth. It's $10-15 to go see a movie here. I get more entertainment enjoyment out of my "dreaming" about the money than I do sitting in a theater watching most movies these days. And I don't buy popcorn with my dreaming. I spend less on the lottery than my wife does getting her nails done. But I will NEVER use that argument. I'm too smart.

I see SSS saying is it voluntary. But studies have shown that the poor and minorities are more likely to "volunteer" a greater amount of their incomes to his retirement fund. That argument (a greater negative affect of minorities and poor) is used by the left and him everywhere as a reasoning against everything from voter ID to healthcare funding. Seems a little hypocritical to me. If it were up to me I'd get rid of the lottery and require voter ID. I'd rather see people be able to afford those expensive state IDs than fund his retirement. But that is just me.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson

User avatar
BackInTex
Posts: 12780
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:43 pm
Location: In Texas of course!

Re: A political statement

#8 Post by BackInTex » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:20 am

silverscreenselect wrote: I have thought about that more than once... is helping to fund my grandchildren's college education (and indirectly my daughter's retirement,.
So the fact that the negatives disproportionately affect minorities and the poor....C'est la vie.


Welcome to your version of the Republican party.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson

User avatar
Bob Juch
Posts: 26427
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:58 am
Location: Oro Valley, Arizona
Contact:

Re: A political statement

#9 Post by Bob Juch » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:50 am

silverscreenselect wrote:
littlebeast13 wrote: or basically, the lottery proceeds are in reality going towards funding all kinds of other state projects and pork barrel stuff besides education.
I can't speak for other states, but in Georgia, from day one, profits went to fund college scholarships for Georgia residents (later expanded, as revenue rose, to include pre-K programs). This was not a case of lottery money simply going into the general education fund (or the general revenue fund) and presumably replacing other money that would have been spent anyway, but a case of it going towards a brand new program that the state had never paid for before (and, without the lottery, probably never would have). It's the same as a special tax assessment that goes to pay for a particular highway construction, except that the lottery is voluntary. Last fiscal year, that was $1.1 billion (and will be more this year).
You may recall that in 2008/9 I worked for IBM upgrading the stand-alone mainframe used for the New Jersey Higher Education Student Assistance Authority. While there I learned that they got a big slice of lottery revenue but not all of it. I looked up this:
Since its inception in 1970, the Lottery has dedicated nearly $25 billion to programs and institutions that benefit millions of New Jersey residents. The Departments of Agriculture, Education, Human Services, Military and Veterans Affairs and Higher Education Services receive support from Lottery generated revenue. Some of the programs and institutions that receive Lottery funding include the: School Nutrition Program, Tuition Aid Grants, Student Tuition Assistance Reward Scholarship (NJ Stars), Marie H. Katzenbach School for the Deaf, centers for developmentally disabled, state psychiatric hospitals and homes for New Jersey’s disabled soldiers.
I may not have gone where I intended to go, but I think I have ended up where I needed to be.
- Douglas Adams (1952 - 2001)

Si fractum non sit, noli id reficere.

Teach a child to be polite and courteous in the home and, when he grows up, he'll never be able to drive in New Jersey.

User avatar
jarnon
Posts: 6264
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:52 pm
Location: Merion, Pa.

Re: A political statement

#10 Post by jarnon » Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:21 pm

littlebeast13 wrote:The same could be said about my job. Every employed person has some kind of deal with the devil...

lb13
Having grown up during the Vietnam War protests, I felt conflicted about working on military contracts, and eventually (when my company became part of Lockheed Martin), being an employee of a corporation that built devastating weapons.
Слава Україні!
עם ישראל חי

User avatar
Beebs52
Queen of Wack
Posts: 14892
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:38 am
Location: Location.Location.Location

Re: A political statement

#11 Post by Beebs52 » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:58 pm

jarnon wrote:
littlebeast13 wrote:The same could be said about my job. Every employed person has some kind of deal with the devil...

lb13
Having grown up during the Vietnam War protests, I felt conflicted about working on military contracts, and eventually (when my company became part of Lockheed Martin), being an employee of a corporation that built devastating weapons.
So did you go to work elsewhere?
Well, then

User avatar
jarnon
Posts: 6264
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:52 pm
Location: Merion, Pa.

Re: A political statement

#12 Post by jarnon » Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:16 pm

Beebs52 wrote:
jarnon wrote:
littlebeast13 wrote:The same could be said about my job. Every employed person has some kind of deal with the devil...

lb13
Having grown up during the Vietnam War protests, I felt conflicted about working on military contracts, and eventually (when my company became part of Lockheed Martin), being an employee of a corporation that built devastating weapons.
So did you go to work elsewhere?
I stayed there for 20 years after it became Lockheed Martin. I think on the whole, the programs I worked on helped humanity. But I feel guilty when I read quotes like this:
Pope Francis wrote:Here we have to ask ourselves: Why are deadly weapons being sold to those who plan to inflict untold suffering on individuals and society? Sadly, the answer, as we all know, is simply for money: money that is drenched in blood, often innocent blood. In the face of this shameful and culpable silence, it is our duty to confront the problem and to stop the arms trade.
Слава Україні!
עם ישראל חי

User avatar
Beebs52
Queen of Wack
Posts: 14892
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:38 am
Location: Location.Location.Location

Re: A political statement

#13 Post by Beebs52 » Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:21 pm

jarnon wrote:
Beebs52 wrote:
jarnon wrote:Having grown up during the Vietnam War protests, I felt conflicted about working on military contracts, and eventually (when my company became part of Lockheed Martin), being an employee of a corporation that built devastating weapons.
So did you go to work elsewhere?
I stayed there for 20 years after it became Lockheed Martin. I think on the whole, the programs I worked on helped humanity. But I feel guilty when I read quotes like this:
Pope Francis wrote:Here we have to ask ourselves: Why are deadly weapons being sold to those who plan to inflict untold suffering on individuals and society? Sadly, the answer, as we all know, is simply for money: money that is drenched in blood, often innocent blood. In the face of this shameful and culpable silence, it is our duty to confront the problem and to stop the arms trade.
You realize how fraught that statement is with discrepancies, your own participation, and the absolutes of right and wrong.
Well, then

User avatar
silverscreenselect
Posts: 23177
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:21 pm
Contact:

Re: A political statement

#14 Post by silverscreenselect » Sat Oct 20, 2018 10:29 pm

BackInTex wrote:Unless there is an analysis that shows x% of state tax revenues going to education pre & post lottery is equal and that education funding is increased $ for $ by lottery proceeds it's all money manipulation (as I suspect it is in Texas).
That's not really the case here. The question isn't how much is or isn't spent on "education" in general; it's how much is spent on these particular programs. And in this case the math is very simple. Before the lottery, the state spent nothing on funding college scholarships and pre-k. So every dollar of that $1.5 billion something that wasn't being spent before and wouldn't have been spent.

The same criticisms you make about this money just going to cover general revenue were made when the legislature here debated the bill in the first place, which is why it was set up with the specific purpose of funding specified programs.
Check out our website: http://www.silverscreenvideos.com

Post Reply