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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 8:47 pm 
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BackInTex wrote:
Bob Juch wrote:
jarnon wrote:
DOJ watchdog finds James Comey defied authority as FBI director, sources say

It appears Horowitz is as tough on Comey and Lynch as on McCabe. Next on his agenda: Was the FBI investigation of the Trump campaign, whether by court-approved wiretaps or informants like Steele and Halper, by the book or political spying?

trump's not going to like the report he's been begging for. :lol:


Why?

You'll know when you see it. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:08 pm 
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jarnon wrote:
It appears Horowitz is as tough on Comey and Lynch as on McCabe. Next on his agenda: Was the FBI investigation of the Trump campaign, whether by court-approved wiretaps or informants like Steele and Halper, by the book or political spying?


Quote:
The draft of Horowitz's wide-ranging report specifically called out Comey for ignoring objections from the Justice Department when he disclosed in a letter to Congress just days before the 2016 presidential election that FBI agents had reopened the Clinton probe, according to sources. Clinton has said that letter doomed her campaign.


It appears that the Republicans like Trey Gowdy who have seen the reports about the "spying" either say it was by the book or are conveniently silent on the subject.

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:46 pm 
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Bob Juch wrote:
jarnon wrote:
jarnon wrote:
Rod Rosenstein asks DOJ inspector general to review possible Trump campaign infiltration

The Inspector General has proven to be thorough and willing to criticize respected officials like McCabe. I trust him to determine if the wiretapping of Trump associates and the use of informants was political spying, or a proper investigation of alleged criminals like Flynn and Manafort.
DOJ watchdog finds James Comey defied authority as FBI director, sources say

It appears Horowitz is as tough on Comey and Lynch as on McCabe. Next on his agenda: Was the FBI investigation of the Trump campaign, whether by court-approved wiretaps or informants like Steele and Halper, by the book or political spying?

trump's not going to like the report he's been begging for. :lol:
The IG report is expected to be published on June 14, Trump's 72nd birthday. Horowitz will be on Capitol Hill the following week.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 12:48 pm 
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jarnon wrote:
The IG report is expected to be published on June 14, Trump's 72nd birthday. Horowitz will be on Capitol Hill the following week.
Here’s the IG report. Without reading all 500 pages, I can tell it’s critical of everyone at the FBI and Justice Dept.

Happy birthday, Mr. President.

The report on alleged political spying is next.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 12:58 pm 
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jarnon wrote:
jarnon wrote:
The IG report is expected to be published on June 14, Trump's 72nd birthday. Horowitz will be on Capitol Hill the following week.
Here’s the IG report. Without reading all 500 pages, I can tell it’s critical of everyone at the FBI and Justice Dept.

Happy birthday, Mr. President.

The report on alleged political spying is next.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trump-receiving-briefing-ahead-of-public-release-of-report-expected-to-criticize-fbi/2018/06/14/c08c6a5a-6fdf-11e8-bf86-a2351b5ece99_story.html?utm_term=.2d681605d724

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 1:29 pm 
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jarnon wrote:
jarnon wrote:
The IG report is expected to be published on June 14, Trump's 72nd birthday. Horowitz will be on Capitol Hill the following week.
Here’s the IG report. Without reading all 500 pages, I can tell it’s critical of everyone at the FBI and Justice Dept.

Happy birthday, Mr. President.

The report on alleged political spying is next.
As I understand it, the conclusion was that Comey's motivations were not political, but by breaking Justice Department policy he opened the FBI's motivations up to criticism. --Bob

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 1:38 pm 
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Bob78164 wrote:
jarnon wrote:
jarnon wrote:
The IG report is expected to be published on June 14, Trump's 72nd birthday. Horowitz will be on Capitol Hill the following week.
Here’s the IG report. Without reading all 500 pages, I can tell it’s critical of everyone at the FBI and Justice Dept.

Happy birthday, Mr. President.

The report on alleged political spying is next.
As I understand it, the conclusion was that Comey's motivations were not political, but by breaking Justice Department policy he opened the FBI's motivations up to criticism. --Bob

“Mistakes were made,” the FBI said in a lengthy statement issued in response to the report. The bureau admitted to “errors of judgment, violations of or disregard for policy, or, when viewed with the benefit of hindsight, simply not the best courses of action. They were not, in any respect, the result of bias or improper considerations.”

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 1:40 pm 
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Bob Juch wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:
jarnon wrote:
Here’s the IG report. Without reading all 500 pages, I can tell it’s critical of everyone at the FBI and Justice Dept.

Happy birthday, Mr. President.

The report on alleged political spying is next.
As I understand it, the conclusion was that Comey's motivations were not political, but by breaking Justice Department policy he opened the FBI's motivations up to criticism. --Bob

“Mistakes were made,” the FBI said in a lengthy statement issued in response to the report. The bureau admitted to “errors of judgment, violations of or disregard for policy, or, when viewed with the benefit of hindsight, simply not the best courses of action. They were not, in any respect, the result of bias or improper considerations.”


The big problem is that the mistakes continue and are multiplied as time goes on.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 1:52 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
The big problem is that the mistakes continue and are multiplied as time goes on.


What mistakes has Mueller made?

The vast majority of the "mistakes" that Comey and others made came down in favor of Trump.

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:19 pm 
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silverscreenselect wrote:
The vast majority of the "mistakes" that Comey and others made came down in favor of Trump
While Comey didn't display political bias, other investigators who were openly anti-Trump made errors that landed him in the White House.

Quote:
Lisa Page: “[Trump’s] not ever going to become president, right? Right?!”

Peter Strzok: “No. No he won’t. We’ll stop it.”

Jake Tapper wrote:
Moreover -- and this is a complicated one so stay with me -- the IG suggests that Strzok may have had bias that impacted a decision to not prioritize the Weiner computer issue -- though how this went down may have ultimately hurt Hillary Clinton.

Weiner laptop sat there from September 29 through Oct 27. IG believes the only thing that prompted FBI to finally act on Weiner laptop were "people outside of the FBI" (from US Attorney SDNY) asking about it

In other words, IG suspects Strzok was biased against Trump, and that may have influenced the decision to sit on the Weiner laptop for a month. Which might have ultimately set a course of events in motion that cost Clinton, his preferred candidate, the presidency.


Last edited by jarnon on Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:27 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
The big problem is that the mistakes continue and are multiplied as time goes on.
I strongly support law enforcement. But I can think of plenty of examples of incompetence and malfeasance by the FBI and other federal crime-fighting agencies, such as:
  • Targeting leftists and the civil rights movement in the '60s.
  • Political spying under Nixon, Mitchell and Gray
  • Failure to guard against terror attacks
  • Selling firearms to Mexican drug dealers
  • Botched investigation of Clinton emails
I hope that political spying on the Trump campaign won't be the next example.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:42 pm 
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jarnon wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
The big problem is that the mistakes continue and are multiplied as time goes on.
I strongly support law enforcement. But I can think of plenty of examples of incompetence and malfeasance by the FBI and other federal crime-fighting agencies, such as:
  • Targeting leftists and the civil rights movement in the '60s.
  • Political spying under Nixon, Mitchell and Gray
  • Failure to guard against terror attacks
  • Selling firearms to Mexican drug dealers
  • Botched investigation of Clinton emails
I hope that political spying on the Trump campaign won't be the next example.
Let's not forget the one-sided disclosure that Clinton was under investigation while simultaneously concealing from the public that her opponent's campaign was also under investigation. --Bob

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:44 pm 
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Just out of curiosity, I wonder if the Inspector General looked at the e-mails and texts of every FBI agent having anything to do with the investigation, how many anti-Hillary or pro-Trump jokes or comments would have shown up?

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:48 pm 
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Bob78164 wrote:
jarnon wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
The big problem is that the mistakes continue and are multiplied as time goes on.
I strongly support law enforcement. But I can think of plenty of examples of incompetence and malfeasance by the FBI and other federal crime-fighting agencies, such as:
  • Targeting leftists and the civil rights movement in the '60s.
  • Political spying under Nixon, Mitchell and Gray
  • Failure to guard against terror attacks
  • Selling firearms to Mexican drug dealers
  • Botched investigation of Clinton emails
I hope that political spying on the Trump campaign won't be the next example.
Let's not forget the one-sided disclosure that Clinton was under investigation while simultaneously concealing from the public that her opponent's campaign was also under investigation. --Bob


Trump was never under investigation, but Comey would not say that publicly.

Also:

PAGE: "[Trump's] not ever going to become president, right? Right?!"
STRZOK: "No. No he won't. We'll stop it."

Smoking Gun.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:03 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:
jarnon wrote:
I strongly support law enforcement. But I can think of plenty of examples of incompetence and malfeasance by the FBI and other federal crime-fighting agencies, such as:
  • Targeting leftists and the civil rights movement in the '60s.
  • Political spying under Nixon, Mitchell and Gray
  • Failure to guard against terror attacks
  • Selling firearms to Mexican drug dealers
  • Botched investigation of Clinton emails
I hope that political spying on the Trump campaign won't be the next example.
Let's not forget the one-sided disclosure that Clinton was under investigation while simultaneously concealing from the public that her opponent's campaign was also under investigation. --Bob


Trump was never under investigation, but Comey would not say that publicly.

Also:

PAGE: "[Trump's] not ever going to become president, right? Right?!"
STRZOK: "No. No he won't. We'll stop it."

Smoking Gun.
Nope. Lots of agents didn't want Secretary Clinton to win. That doesn't matter either. The question is whether their political preferences affected the findings. The Inspector General was quite clear that they did not.

The Justice Department doesn't make disclosures like that for exactly the reasons that played out in the 2016 election. Comey wanted "transparency" as to the Clinton campaign because he was convinced she would win. He didn't care about "transparency" as to Donny's campaign because he didn't think that campaign would win, so the American people didn't need to know. That wasn't his decision to make, but he made it anyway, thereby changing the course of history. --Bob

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:31 pm 
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Bob78164 wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:
Let's not forget the one-sided disclosure that Clinton was under investigation while simultaneously concealing from the public that her opponent's campaign was also under investigation. --Bob


Trump was never under investigation, but Comey would not say that publicly.

Also:

PAGE: "[Trump's] not ever going to become president, right? Right?!"
STRZOK: "No. No he won't. We'll stop it."

Smoking Gun.
Nope. Lots of agents didn't want Secretary Clinton to win. That doesn't matter either. The question is whether their political preferences affected the findings. The Inspector General was quite clear that they did not.

The Justice Department doesn't make disclosures like that for exactly the reasons that played out in the 2016 election. Comey wanted "transparency" as to the Clinton campaign because he was convinced she would win. He didn't care about "transparency" as to Donny's campaign because he didn't think that campaign would win, so the American people didn't need to know. That wasn't his decision to make, but he made it anyway, thereby changing the course of history. --Bob


Of course not, bob-tel. Name one member of the Mueller team that isn't a democrat or democrat donor. And of course, Strzok was on that team until he was found out. Comey leaked confidential memos in order to get the special prosecutor, he said so himself. Lots of questions, bob-tel, which you don't want to address fair-mindedly or completely ignore, because you have a closed mind.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:58 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:

Trump was never under investigation, but Comey would not say that publicly.

Also:

PAGE: "[Trump's] not ever going to become president, right? Right?!"
STRZOK: "No. No he won't. We'll stop it."

Smoking Gun.
Nope. Lots of agents didn't want Secretary Clinton to win. That doesn't matter either. The question is whether their political preferences affected the findings. The Inspector General was quite clear that they did not.

The Justice Department doesn't make disclosures like that for exactly the reasons that played out in the 2016 election. Comey wanted "transparency" as to the Clinton campaign because he was convinced she would win. He didn't care about "transparency" as to Donny's campaign because he didn't think that campaign would win, so the American people didn't need to know. That wasn't his decision to make, but he made it anyway, thereby changing the course of history. --Bob


Of course not, bob-tel. Name one member of the Mueller team that isn't a democrat or democrat donor. And of course, Strzok was on that team until he was found out. Comey leaked confidential memos in order to get the special prosecutor, he said so himself. Lots of questions, bob-tel, which you don't want to address fair-mindedly or completely ignore, because you have a closed mind.
Mueller himself is a lifelong Republican. --Bob

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:11 pm 
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Bob78164 wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:
Nope. Lots of agents didn't want Secretary Clinton to win. That doesn't matter either. The question is whether their political preferences affected the findings. The Inspector General was quite clear that they did not.

The Justice Department doesn't make disclosures like that for exactly the reasons that played out in the 2016 election. Comey wanted "transparency" as to the Clinton campaign because he was convinced she would win. He didn't care about "transparency" as to Donny's campaign because he didn't think that campaign would win, so the American people didn't need to know. That wasn't his decision to make, but he made it anyway, thereby changing the course of history. --Bob


Of course not, bob-tel. Name one member of the Mueller team that isn't a democrat or democrat donor. And of course, Strzok was on that team until he was found out. Comey leaked confidential memos in order to get the special prosecutor, he said so himself. Lots of questions, bob-tel, which you don't want to address fair-mindedly or completely ignore, because you have a closed mind.
Mueller himself is a lifelong Republican. --Bob

I confuse establishment, McCain Republicans with Democrats all the time. My bad.Name the trump supporters on the team. How badly are they outnumbered?


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:12 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Name one member of the Mueller team that isn't a democrat or democrat donor.


Here is a listing that seems fairly recent of the lawyers on Mueller's team. Some of them have donated to Democratic campaigns and/or represented Obama or Hillary in various governmental or civil capacities. I don't know of any law that requires people to identify their party affiliation.

But if you get past the name calling and look at the record, here are some of the prosecutions in which they have been successfully involved:

Megaupload
Guccifer 1
Ardit Ferizi (Kosovoan hacker who gave info on US servicemen to ISIS)
Mohan Nirala (Intelligence employee who smuggled 500 pages of classified documents to his home)
Najibullah Zazi (Al Qaeda terrorist who planned NYC Subway bombing)
Muhanad Mahmoud Al Farekh (Al Qaeda terrorist who planned attack on US troops in Afghanistan)
Robert Allen Stanford
Numerous Bonano crime family members
Bankrate VP charged with wire fraud
Mother/son team convicted of $16 million Medicare fraud
Wolf of Wall Street production company (civil forfeiture case)
Sheldon Silver (Democratic speaker of New York Assembly)
CityTime (NYC Municipal fraud case involving over 100 witnesses)
Volkswagen (Civil settlements in emissions case)
Andrew Fastow (Enron CFO)
Members of Genovese, Colombo, and Gambino crime families
Zacarias Moussaoui
Terrorists involved in Kenya and Tanzania embassy bombings

These are not party hacks. They are top notch attorneys who would seem to be exactly the type of people you would want investigating the types of serious crimes that are being discussed here. These are not the type of people who go shooting their mouths off to the press, which is why we haven't gotten leaky "progress reports" from Mueller.

https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2018/po ... index.html

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:16 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Name the trump supporters on the team. How badly are they outnumbered?


Since when is a criminal investigation a team sport?

When the indictments come down, and they will, you can judge the nature of the charges and the evidence to back them up.

Based on the performance of much of the Trump administration to date, I wouldn't want them prosecuting a jaywalker, let alone people charged with conspiring with foreign governments.

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:21 pm 
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Just a little note to people that tomorrow is going to be a big day in the Mueller investigation.

1) Paul Manafort will have a hearing on revoking his bail for witness tampering. Tonight could be the last night he spends in a real bed for years.

2) Tomorrow is also the deadline to complete the review of the documents seized in the Michael Cohen case to see how many are actually privileged. Cohen's attorneys are reportedly ready to jump ship and he may be about ready to flip.

Expect major tweeting this weekend.

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:43 pm 
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silverscreenselect wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Name the trump supporters on the team. How badly are they outnumbered?


Since when is a criminal investigation a team sport?

When the indictments come down, and they will, you can judge the nature of the charges and the evidence to back them up.

Based on the performance of much of the Trump administration to date, I wouldn't want them prosecuting a jaywalker, let alone people charged with conspiring with foreign governments.

Can't name any, huh?
I'll say the same thing to you as I said to the ethical counselor. You are not convincing anyone.


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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:44 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Name the trump supporters on the team. How badly are they outnumbered?


I've got a question for you. Suppose there were "enough" Trump supporters on Mueller's investigation team. If they are competent, honest, ethical attorneys, what would they do differently from what Mueller's team is currently doing?

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:33 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:
Bob78164 wrote:
flockofseagulls104 wrote:

Of course not, bob-tel. Name one member of the Mueller team that isn't a democrat or democrat donor. And of course, Strzok was on that team until he was found out. Comey leaked confidential memos in order to get the special prosecutor, he said so himself. Lots of questions, bob-tel, which you don't want to address fair-mindedly or completely ignore, because you have a closed mind.
Mueller himself is a lifelong Republican. --Bob

I confuse establishment, McCain Republicans with Democrats all the time. My bad. Name the trump supporters on the team. How badly are they outnumbered?

There aren't any; you have to be intelligent to be an investigator.

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 Post subject: Re: #Towergate #FakeNews
PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2018 8:09 pm 
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flockofseagulls104 wrote:

Can't name any, huh?
I'll say the same thing to you as I said to the ethical counselor. You are not convincing anyone.


I'll ask you again. What would an honest, ethical, competent Trump supporter do that Mueller's investigators aren't doing?

We've already seen that every Justice Department attorney who has looked into the case is backing Mueller's investigation.

If Mueller is somehow trying to railroad Trump (and we've seen no evidence of that), the people who will probably be indicted and arrested will have some of the best criminal defense attorneys around to try to poke holes in the case.

See how much good that has done Paul Manafort so far.

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