Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

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Bob Juch
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Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#1 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:37 am

Charles Lister ✔ @Charles_Lister
.@washingtonpost Widespread reports of multiple chlorine bombs dropped on areas of East Ghouta outside #Damascus.#Assad continues to act with impunity.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#2 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:40 am

Colin Taylor wrote:The alleged chlorine gas strikes were part of a ferocious bombing campaign carried out on rebel positions by Assadi and Russian jets, striking in Idlib, Hama, and Daraa. The message is clear: don’t get your hopes up. The United States will not save you.

Indeed, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson said last night that the strikes would not signal any substantial change in the administration’s policy on Syria, tacitly admitting that this was a one-off show of force.

Trump’s actions last night were all a charade. Trump cares nothing for the children of Syria or the struggle of the rebels against a leader who butchers his own people by the tens of thousands.

Trump wanted to flex his muscles in front of the Chinese premier, who was dining with him at Mar-a-Lago, and perhaps earn himself a little bump in the polls and praise from the media. He wanted to look like a decisive president, to revel in the power of the presidency, to remind himself of what a powerful leader he was.

But it was all a sham. The Pentagon informed the Russians about the strike at al-Shayrat so they could withdraw their military personnel from the base. Russia told the Syrians, who evacuated the al-Shayrat airbase. Trump gave the order and the missiles flew, killing nine civilians, including four children.

The next day, Trump goes back to golfing and Assad goes back to butchering. President Trump has done his fair share of shameless exploitation, but it is truly soul-wrenchingly repulsive to see him feign sorrow for the dead Syrian children he banned from entering our country and use their deaths as an excuse to massage his ego with a fireworks show.

For the record, Assad also dropped chlorine bombs on the village of al-Lataminah in Hama province the same morning Trump decided to strike. There were nine chemical attacks by the Syrian regime this year before the strike on Khan Sheikhoun, but Trump never had anything to say about those.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#3 Post by Spock » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:55 am

This is not possible and neither was the earlier attack that lead to the Tomahawk strike. The Obama administration solved the problem.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... ical-weap/

>>>The outcry leads us to revisit a 2014 claim from former Secretary of State John Kerry. Kerry said in a television interview that in Syria, "we got 100 percent of the chemical weapons out."<<<

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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#4 Post by Bob78164 » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:59 am

That's the thing. I don't (think I) have an issue with bombing the Syrian capacity to wage chemical warfare, though with no American lives imminently in danger I'd at least prefer Congressional authorization. (Given the distances involved, this isn't as urgent for me as it might be because I don't think American troops were actually in danger from hostile fire.) But if this was just a one-off, then we're allowing Assad to expose us as a paper tiger. If that's all we had in mind, far better to have kept our powder dry so as to maintain the credibility of threatened action.

And if it wasn't a one-off, then we needed to already have in place a strategy to finish the job of removing Syria's capacity for chemical warfare. I've seen no evidence yet that this Administration has any capacity for long-term planning. --Bob
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#5 Post by silverscreenselect » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:01 pm

Spock wrote:This is not possible and neither was the earlier attack that lead to the Tomahawk strike. The Obama administration solved the problem.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... ical-weap/

>>>The outcry leads us to revisit a 2014 claim from former Secretary of State John Kerry. Kerry said in a television interview that in Syria, "we got 100 percent of the chemical weapons out."<<<
Regardless of whether Assad "got rid" of all the weapons, the fact is that he didn't use them for nearly four years following Obama's actions. It took Trump one careless comment to undo that.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#6 Post by Bob78164 » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:02 pm

Spock wrote:This is not possible and neither was the earlier attack that lead to the Tomahawk strike. The Obama administration solved the problem.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... ical-weap/

>>>The outcry leads us to revisit a 2014 claim from former Secretary of State John Kerry. Kerry said in a television interview that in Syria, "we got 100 percent of the chemical weapons out."<<<
President Obama isn't the leader who ordered the American military into action last night, and he's no longer in office. You play the cards you're dealt. The issue is how well the current Administration is playing them. What evidence I've seen to date leads me to believe the answer is, "Poorly." --Bob
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#7 Post by silverscreenselect » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:03 pm

Bob Juch wrote:
Colin Taylor wrote:The alleged chlorine gas strikes were part of a ferocious bombing campaign carried out on rebel positions by Assadi and Russian jets, striking in Idlib, Hama, and Daraa. The message is clear: don’t get your hopes up. The United States will not save you.

Indeed, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson said last night that the strikes would not signal any substantial change in the administration’s policy on Syria, tacitly admitting that this was a one-off show of force.

Trump’s actions last night were all a charade. Trump cares nothing for the children of Syria or the struggle of the rebels against a leader who butchers his own people by the tens of thousands.

Trump wanted to flex his muscles in front of the Chinese premier, who was dining with him at Mar-a-Lago, and perhaps earn himself a little bump in the polls and praise from the media. He wanted to look like a decisive president, to revel in the power of the presidency, to remind himself of what a powerful leader he was.

But it was all a sham. The Pentagon informed the Russians about the strike at al-Shayrat so they could withdraw their military personnel from the base. Russia told the Syrians, who evacuated the al-Shayrat airbase. Trump gave the order and the missiles flew, killing nine civilians, including four children.

The next day, Trump goes back to golfing and Assad goes back to butchering. President Trump has done his fair share of shameless exploitation, but it is truly soul-wrenchingly repulsive to see him feign sorrow for the dead Syrian children he banned from entering our country and use their deaths as an excuse to massage his ego with a fireworks show.

For the record, Assad also dropped chlorine bombs on the village of al-Lataminah in Hama province the same morning Trump decided to strike. There were nine chemical attacks by the Syrian regime this year before the strike on Khan Sheikhoun, but Trump never had anything to say about those.
Bob, I don't know what your source is for these follow-up reports, but I can't find any word of them on any of the news sites I've checked: CNN, USA Today, Washington Post, New York Times, Reuters. I'd be hesitant to credit that, just as I'd be hesitant to accept anyone's version of the amount of damage done in the attack until we've got far more reliable information than we have now.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#8 Post by Spock » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:13 pm

>>> But if this was just a one-off, then we're allowing Assad to expose us as a paper tiger.<<<

How is that different than Obama drawing the "Red Line" and not adhering to it?

>>>President Obama isn't the leader who ordered the American military into action last night, and he's no longer in office. You play the cards you're dealt.<<<

It is somewhat disingenuous on your part to immediately absolve Obama past policies on this.

Obviously, we are still playing the piss-poor hand that Obama dealt on Syria and if we trusted Obama on this the chemical weapons are not there anymore.

I ask you the following question.
1) Was the Obama administration lying when they said they got rid of the chemical weapons, or were they just wrong?

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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#9 Post by Bob78164 » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:19 pm

Spock wrote:>>> But if this was just a one-off, then we're allowing Assad to expose us as a paper tiger.<<<

How is that different than Obama drawing the "Red Line" and not adhering to it?

>>>President Obama isn't the leader who ordered the American military into action last night, and he's no longer in office. You play the cards you're dealt.<<<

It is somewhat disingenuous on your part to immediately absolve Obama past policies on this.

Obviously, we are still playing the piss-poor hand that Obama dealt on Syria and if we trusted Obama on this the chemical weapons are not there anymore.

I ask you the following question.
1) Was the Obama administration lying when they said they got rid of the chemical weapons, or were they just wrong?
They weren't lying. Unknown whether they were wrong at the time. A third possibility is that they were gone but that Assad managed to reacquire some, perhaps from the Russians.

And that "piss-poor hand" was good enough, as S-cubed points out, to keep Assad from using chemical weapons for the remainder of President Obama's term. --Bob
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#10 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:37 pm

silverscreenselect wrote:
Spock wrote:This is not possible and neither was the earlier attack that lead to the Tomahawk strike. The Obama administration solved the problem.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... ical-weap/

>>>The outcry leads us to revisit a 2014 claim from former Secretary of State John Kerry. Kerry said in a television interview that in Syria, "we got 100 percent of the chemical weapons out."<<<
Regardless of whether Assad "got rid" of all the weapons, the fact is that he didn't use them for nearly four years following Obama's actions. It took Trump one careless comment to undo that.
Unfortunately that's not true: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-37049555
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#11 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:42 pm

Spock wrote:>>> But if this was just a one-off, then we're allowing Assad to expose us as a paper tiger.<<<

How is that different than Obama drawing the "Red Line" and not adhering to it?

>>>President Obama isn't the leader who ordered the American military into action last night, and he's no longer in office. You play the cards you're dealt.<<<

It is somewhat disingenuous on your part to immediately absolve Obama past policies on this.

Obviously, we are still playing the piss-poor hand that Obama dealt on Syria and if we trusted Obama on this the chemical weapons are not there anymore.

I ask you the following question.
1) Was the Obama administration lying when they said they got rid of the chemical weapons or were they just wrong?
They were lied to: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/wor ... 100150344/
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#12 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 12:47 pm

silverscreenselect wrote:
Bob Juch wrote:
Colin Taylor wrote:The alleged chlorine gas strikes were part of a ferocious bombing campaign carried out on rebel positions by Assadi and Russian jets, striking in Idlib, Hama, and Daraa. The message is clear: don’t get your hopes up. The United States will not save you.

Indeed, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson said last night that the strikes would not signal any substantial change in the administration’s policy on Syria, tacitly admitting that this was a one-off show of force.

Trump’s actions last night were all a charade. Trump cares nothing for the children of Syria or the struggle of the rebels against a leader who butchers his own people by the tens of thousands.

Trump wanted to flex his muscles in front of the Chinese premier, who was dining with him at Mar-a-Lago, and perhaps earn himself a little bump in the polls and praise from the media. He wanted to look like a decisive president, to revel in the power of the presidency, to remind himself of what a powerful leader he was.

But it was all a sham. The Pentagon informed the Russians about the strike at al-Shayrat so they could withdraw their military personnel from the base. Russia told the Syrians, who evacuated the al-Shayrat airbase. Trump gave the order and the missiles flew, killing nine civilians, including four children.

The next day, Trump goes back to golfing and Assad goes back to butchering. President Trump has done his fair share of shameless exploitation, but it is truly soul-wrenchingly repulsive to see him feign sorrow for the dead Syrian children he banned from entering our country and use their deaths as an excuse to massage his ego with a fireworks show.

For the record, Assad also dropped chlorine bombs on the village of al-Lataminah in Hama province the same morning Trump decided to strike. There were nine chemical attacks by the Syrian regime this year before the strike on Khan Sheikhoun, but Trump never had anything to say about those.
Bob, I don't know what your source is for these follow-up reports, but I can't find any word of them on any of the news sites I've checked: CNN, USA Today, Washington Post, New York Times, Reuters. I'd be hesitant to credit that, just as I'd be hesitant to accept anyone's version of the amount of damage done in the attack until we've got far more reliable information than we have now.
This is on Thursday's attack: http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Report ... eek-486277

Today's hasn't hit the mainstream news yet.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#13 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:36 pm

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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#14 Post by silverscreenselect » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:54 pm

Bob:

Your first link, from the Jerusalem Post, clearly indicates that the attack in that article occurred before Trump's reprisal raid, so it's not fair to say that Assad resumed gas attacks after the raid. As for the second source, I've never heard of "newsgroopspeak" and I'm not going to give it much credibility until I see this information reported in a reputable source. This article links to someone supposedly from the Washington Post, but the Post isn't reporting this attack, and I'd think they would do so if and when the Syrians do resume their attacks.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#15 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:57 pm

silverscreenselect wrote:
Bob:

Your first link, from the Jerusalem Post, clearly indicates that the attack in that article occurred before Trump's reprisal raid, so it's not fair to say that Assad resumed gas attacks after the raid. As for the second source, I've never heard of "newsgroopspeak" and I'm not going to give it much credibility until I see this information reported in a reputable source. This article links to someone supposedly from the Washington Post, but the Post isn't reporting this attack, and I'd think they would do so if and when the Syrians do resume their attacks.
Yes, I said, my first post was about Thursday's attack. I'm continuing to check for a mainstream report of today's attack. As you should realize, getting verified reports from remote areas of Syria is difficult.
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Re: Assad promptly drops chlorine bombs

#16 Post by Bob Juch » Fri Apr 07, 2017 2:20 pm

Bob Juch wrote:
silverscreenselect wrote:
Bob:

Your first link, from the Jerusalem Post, clearly indicates that the attack in that article occurred before Trump's reprisal raid, so it's not fair to say that Assad resumed gas attacks after the raid. As for the second source, I've never heard of "newsgroopspeak" and I'm not going to give it much credibility until I see this information reported in a reputable source. This article links to someone supposedly from the Washington Post, but the Post isn't reporting this attack, and I'd think they would do so if and when the Syrians do resume their attacks.
Yes, I said, my first post was about Thursday's attack. I'm continuing to check for a mainstream report of today's attack. As you should realize, getting verified reports from remote areas of Syria is difficult.
Here are numerous tweets about today's attack. Still nothing on Reuters or The Washington Post's web pages, just tweets.

http://occupydemocrats.com/2017/04/07/a ... civilians/
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