You Might Want to Hold Off on Nobel Peace Prize

[Ritterskoop]

OK, words have got to mean something. Mainstream just means popular, doesn't it? Or well-known?

[Bob78164]

OK, words have got to mean something. Mainstream just means popular, doesn't it? Or well-known?

I don't think so, because the National Enquirer would fit either of those two descriptions and I, for one, don't think that's a phrase I'd use to describe the Enquirer.

I kind of think of it like science. There are certain basic standards any subject has to adhere to if it wants to meaningfully call itself a science; most importantly, a rigorous examination of evidence.

I think for an outlet to be called mainstream press, in addition to some minimal level of prominence or presence, it also must have sufficient respect for journalistic standards to earn the title "press." --Bob

[flockofseagulls104]

OK, words have got to mean something. Mainstream just means popular, doesn't it? Or well-known?

I don't think so, because the National Enquirer would fit either of those two descriptions and I, for one, don't think that's a phrase I'd use to describe the Enquirer.

I kind of think of it like science. There are certain basic standards any subject has to adhere to if it wants to meaningfully call itself a science; most importantly, a rigorous examination of evidence.

I think for an outlet to be called mainstream press, in addition to some minimal level of prominence or presence, it also must have sufficient respect for journalistic standards to earn the title "press." --Bob

And every day, bobtel, the NYT, ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and others show that they care more about their agenda and their narrative of what's 'good' and 'bad' than they do in reporting the actual facts and all the facts. I will give you that FOX has an agenda as well, but they report fairly on many things that the others don't or won't. Don't give me the BS that they make it up. Their news reporting is every bit as professional as the others I mentioned. Like it or not, they are the balance. But you've got to take all that's reported with a grain of salt. Pure journalism is dead, since the prime goal is ratings and the bottom line.

[jarnon]

President Donald J. Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea (DPRK) held a first, historic summit in Singapore on June 12, 2018.

President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un conducted a comprehensive, in-depth, and sincere exchange of opinions on the issues related to the establishment of new U.S.-DPRK relations and the building of a lasting and robust peace regime on the Korean Peninsula. President Trump committed to provide security guarantees to the DPRK, and Chairman Kim Jong Un reaffirmed his firm and unwavering commitment to complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

Convinced that the establishment of new U.S.-DPRK relations will contribute to the peace and prosperity of the Korean Peninsula and of the world, and recognizing that mutual confidence building can promote the denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un state the following:

1. The United States and the DPRK commit to establish new U.S.-DPRK relations in accordance with the desire of the peoples of the two countries for peace and prosperity.

2. The United States and the DPRK will join their efforts to build a lasting and stable peace regime on the Korean Peninsula.

3. Reaffirming the April 27, 2018 Panmunjom Declaration, the DPRK commits to work toward complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

4. The United States and the DPRK commit to recovering POW/MIA remains, including the immediate repatriation of those already identified.

Having acknowledged that the U.S.-DPRK summit — the first in history — was an epochal event of great significance in overcoming decades of tensions and hostilities between the two countries and for the opening up of a new future, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un commit to implement the stipulations in this joint statement fully and expeditiously. The United States and the DPRK commit to hold follow-up negotiations, led by the U.S. Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, and a relevant high-level DPRK official, at the earliest possible date, to implement the outcomes of the U.S.-DPRK summit.

President Donald J. Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea have committed to cooperate for the development of new U.S.-DPRK relations and for the promotion of peace, prosperity, and security of the Korean Peninsula and of the world.

[Bob78164]

Their news reporting is every bit as professional as the others I mentioned.

If by "professional" you mean they get paid for it, I have to agree with you. But if by "professional" you mean they adhere to standards of journalistic integrity, trying to get their facts right,

But to know that you have to be willing to read primary sources (which is why I try to cite them here) and do your own analysis (which is why I explain my reasoning here), not throw up your hands in despair because you think the disputes are too difficult to referee, or devolve to name-calling when you can't meet a substantive argument.

Most people have learned a long time ago to be skeptical of people who tell them only what they want to hear. Fox News makes its living off of those who can't or won't learn that lesson.

We get the democracy we insist on. That democracy requires both an unfettered press and a well-informed populace. Donny would obviously fetter the press if he could, and Fox News is doing its best to contribute to a less-informed populace. I insist on better. --Bob

[flockofseagulls104]

Their news reporting is every bit as professional as the others I mentioned.

If by "professional" you mean they get paid for it, I have to agree with you. But if by "professional" you mean they adhere to standards of journalistic integrity, trying to get their facts right,

But to know that you have to be willing to read primary sources (which is why I try to cite them here) and do your own analysis (which is why I explain my reasoning here), not throw up your hands in despair because you think the disputes are too difficult to referee, or devolve to name-calling when you can't meet a substantive argument.

Most people have learned a long time ago to be skeptical of people who tell them only what they want to hear. Fox News makes its living off of those who can't or won't learn that lesson.

We get the democracy we insist on. That democracy requires both an unfettered press and a well-informed populace. Donny would obviously fetter the press if he could, and Fox News is doing its best to contribute to a less-informed populace. I insist on better. --Bob

Sorry, the diet pepsi came out through my nose when I read this one. What a bunch of self-righteous malarkey.

[silverscreenselect]

But no regime has oppressed its own citizens more totally, more brutally, than the cruel dictatorship in North Korea. ...We need only look at the depraved character of the North Korean regime to understand the nature of the nuclear threat it could pose to America and to our allies.

[Kim's] country does love him. His people, you see the fervor. They have a great fervor.

[Kim] has to be a rough guy or he has been a rough person. But we got along very well. He's smart, loves his people, he loves his country. He wants a lot of good things and that's why he's doing this.... Look, he's doing what he's seen done, if you look at it.

[silverscreenselect]

President Donald J. Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea (DPRK) held a first, historic summit in Singapore on June 12, 2018.

President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un conducted a comprehensive, in-depth, and sincere exchange of opinions on the issues related to the establishment of new U.S.-DPRK relations and the building of a lasting and robust peace regime on the Korean Peninsula. President Trump committed to provide security guarantees to the DPRK, and Chairman Kim Jong Un reaffirmed his firm and unwavering commitment to complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

Convinced that the establishment of new U.S.-DPRK relations will contribute to the peace and prosperity of the Korean Peninsula and of the world, and recognizing that mutual confidence building can promote the denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un state the following:

1. The United States and the DPRK commit to establish new U.S.-DPRK relations in accordance with the desire of the peoples of the two countries for peace and prosperity.

2. The United States and the DPRK will join their efforts to build a lasting and stable peace regime on the Korean Peninsula.

3. Reaffirming the April 27, 2018 Panmunjom Declaration, the DPRK commits to work toward complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

4. The United States and the DPRK commit to recovering POW/MIA remains, including the immediate repatriation of those already identified.

Having acknowledged that the U.S.-DPRK summit — the first in history — was an epochal event of great significance in overcoming decades of tensions and hostilities between the two countries and for the opening up of a new future, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un commit to implement the stipulations in this joint statement fully and expeditiously. The United States and the DPRK commit to hold follow-up negotiations, led by the U.S. Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, and a relevant high-level DPRK official, at the earliest possible date, to implement the outcomes of the U.S.-DPRK summit.

President Donald J. Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea have committed to cooperate for the development of new U.S.-DPRK relations and for the promotion of peace, prosperity, and security of the Korean Peninsula and of the world.

Add another. Trump announced the end of military exercises with South Korea (a major part of their defense planning) without discussing it with the South Koreans beforehand.

[jarnon]

Here's one case where they got it right:

At his press conference (at 4 a.m. our time) Trump referred to Bill Clinton's presidency as the "Clinton regime." Not an intentional provocation, just a sleep-deprived slip of the tongue. Sounds like a Freudian slip to me.

[BackInTex]

Add another. Trump announced the end of military exercises with South Korea (a major part of their defense planning) without discussing it with the South Koreans beforehand.

How do you know that? Did you have a conversation with South Korea's ambassador?

[Bob Juch]

One thing that was added that is of personal concern to me: N.K. is going to repatriate the remains of Americans from the Korean War. My father's may be among them.

[BackInTex]

One thing that was added that is of personal concern to me: N.K. is going to repatriate the remains of Americans from the Korean War. My father's may be among them.

All kidding, sniping, and disagreements aside, I hope that may be the case for you.

[silverscreenselect]

Add another. Trump announced the end of military exercises with South Korea (a major part of their defense planning) without discussing it with the South Koreans beforehand.

How do you know that? Did you have a conversation with South Korea's ambassador?

No; I just look at something other than Fox News.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... rth-summit

Other sources have said pretty much the same thing.

[tlynn78]

Add another. Trump announced the end of military exercises with South Korea (a major part of their defense planning) without discussing it with the South Koreans beforehand.

How do you know that? Did you have a conversation with South Korea's ambassador?

Of course SSs doesn't know any such thing. Trump did what he set out to do, what SSS and his ilk desperately hoped he'd fail at, in spite of what a success would actually mean. All that matters to them is that by any measure this must be a plus in Trump's column, and that's unacceptable. Now they have to move on to a) hoping the agreement falls apart, and b) come on, Recession!!

[silverscreenselect]

Trump did what he set out to do, what SSS and his ilk desperately hoped he'd fail at, in spite of what a success would actually mean. All that matters to them is that by any measure this must be a plus in Trump's column, and that's unacceptable. Now they have to move on to a) hoping the agreement falls apart, and b) come on, Recession!!

Trump did what he set out to do, get something he could declare as a win that means virtually nothing. In exchange, he is giving up something of considerable strategic value, the South Korean military exercises, above and beyond the enormous boost in prestige and legitimacy this summit brought to Kim.

Any US president in the last 40 years could have accomplished what Trump did and met with Kim or his father or grandfather. None of them plunged ahead as Trump did.

The "ilk" with whom I am lumped seem to be virtually every analyst who has looked at this situation. We are now in an international posture of sucking up to autocrats and dictators while thumbing our noses in the faces of our longtime allies. One can just imagine what Fox News, Hannity, and the rest of the Trump toadies would have said had Obama done 1/10 of what Trump has in terms of foreign relations.

[tlynn78]

Trump did what he set out to do, what SSS and his ilk desperately hoped he'd fail at, in spite of what a success would actually mean. All that matters to them is that by any measure this must be a plus in Trump's column, and that's unacceptable. Now they have to move on to a) hoping the agreement falls apart, and b) come on, Recession!!

Trump did what he set out to do, get something he could declare as a win that means virtually nothing. In exchange, he is giving up something of considerable strategic value, the South Korean military exercises, above and beyond the enormous boost in prestige and legitimacy this summit brought to Kim.

Any US president in the last 40 years could have accomplished what Trump did and met with Kim or his father or grandfather. None of them plunged ahead as Trump did.

The "ilk" with whom I am lumped seem to be virtually every analyst who has looked at this situation. We are now in an international posture of sucking up to autocrats and dictators while thumbing our noses in the faces of our longtime allies. One can just imagine what Fox News, Hannity, and the rest of the Trump toadies would have said had Obama done 1/10 of what Trump has in terms of foreign relations.

Like I said, you can always hope for a recession.

[flockofseagulls104]

...had Obama done 1/10 of what Trump has in terms of foreign relations.

But you know what? He didn't.

[Bob Juch]

One thing that was added that is of personal concern to me: N.K. is going to repatriate the remains of Americans from the Korean War. My father's may be among them.

All kidding, sniping, and disagreements aside, I hope that may be the case for you.

Thank you. He was only 20. We never met.

[flockofseagulls104]

One thing that was added that is of personal concern to me: N.K. is going to repatriate the remains of Americans from the Korean War. My father's may be among them.

I hope this will happen for you.

[silverscreenselect]

...had Obama done 1/10 of what Trump has in terms of foreign relations.

But you know what? He didn't.

You're right. He didn't make the ridiculous blunders that Trump is making left and right.

[silverscreenselect]

One thing that was added that is of personal concern to me: N.K. is going to repatriate the remains of Americans from the Korean War. My father's may be among them.

All kidding, sniping, and disagreements aside, I hope that may be the case for you.

Thank you. He was only 20. We never met.

I hope this will work out for you and you and your family will find some closure.

[Bob78164]

We're ending joint military exercises with South Korea? A long-standing ally and a democracy that faces a very credible military threat on its very border. Can someone please tell me just what the Great Negotiator got in return for screwing over another ally? --Bob

[Bob Juch]

All kidding, sniping, and disagreements aside, I hope that may be the case for you.

Thank you. He was only 20. We never met.

I hope this will work out for you and you and your family will find some closure.

Thanks, I'm the last of my biological family.

[flockofseagulls104]

...had Obama done 1/10 of what Trump has in terms of foreign relations.

But you know what? He didn't.

You're right. He didn't make the ridiculous blunders that Trump is making left and right.

If this happened under a hillary presidency, you would be overjoyed. It didn't happen under Obama. If it did, you and the MSM would be overjoyed, and I would think the same thing I do now: It is a good thing for the world, but it must be verified very strongly. And if it turns into a Treaty, it must go through Congress.

[Spock]

We're ending joint military exercises with South Korea? A long-standing ally and a democracy that faces a very credible military threat on its very border. Can someone please tell me just what the Great Negotiator got in return for screwing over another ally? --Bob

Now do when Obama scrapped missile defense for Poland and the Czech Republic.