Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
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Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
As this story explains, a review of the docket of the United States Court of Appeal for the D.C. Circuit makes it appear very likely that Donny is currently appealing an order from the United States District Court for the District of Columbia issuing a subpoena requiring Donny to appear and testify before a grand jury. The author of the story is absolutely right about the breakneck speed with which the case he describes is proceeding. --Bob
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
That's nothing compared to the blizzard of subpoenas that will start flying around the first of January when the new House (and hopefully Senate as well) is sworn in.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
This is speculation. Mueller is keeping very quiet around election time (unlike some investigators in 2016). But from what we know from before October, he (along with federal and state prosecutors in New York) have already questioned most of Trump's inner circle.silverscreenselect wrote:That's nothing compared to the blizzard of subpoenas that will start flying around the first of January when the new House (and hopefully Senate as well) is sworn in.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
It's not speculation. It's informed inference based on the docket and other evidence laid out in the article. It may not be right, but I can't think of another plausible explanation for the D.C. Circuit's remarkably quick action with respect to the District Court's order. --Bobjarnon wrote:This is speculation. Mueller is keeping very quiet around election time (unlike some investigators in 2016). But from what we know from before October, he (along with federal and state prosecutors in New York) have already questioned most of Trump's inner circle.silverscreenselect wrote:That's nothing compared to the blizzard of subpoenas that will start flying around the first of January when the new House (and hopefully Senate as well) is sworn in.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
These subpoenas would be coming from Congressional inquiries.jarnon wrote:This is speculation. Mueller is keeping very quiet around election time (unlike some investigators in 2016). But from what we know from before October, he (along with federal and state prosecutors in New York) have already questioned most of Trump's inner circle.silverscreenselect wrote:That's nothing compared to the blizzard of subpoenas that will start flying around the first of January when the new House (and hopefully Senate as well) is sworn in.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
No, Bob, I'm agreeing with you. The speculation is SSS's "that's nothing." I predict that the House Democrats will find little that Mueller doesn't already know about. But there are plenty of House committees and lots of other officials they can investigate: Wilbur Ross, Mulvaney, Mnuchin, Zinke, DeVos, etc.Bob78164 wrote:It's not speculation. It's informed inference based on the docket and other evidence laid out in the article. It may not be right, but I can't think of another plausible explanation for the D.C. Circuit's remarkably quick action with respect to the District Court's order. --Bobjarnon wrote:This is speculation. Mueller is keeping very quiet around election time (unlike some investigators in 2016). But from what we know from before October, he (along with federal and state prosecutors in New York) have already questioned most of Trump's inner circle.silverscreenselect wrote:That's nothing compared to the blizzard of subpoenas that will start flying around the first of January when the new House (and hopefully Senate as well) is sworn in.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
But they can make a lot of information public that Mueller can't simply by holding public hearings. And that's especially true if Trump tries to get rid of Mueller after the election.jarnon wrote:I predict that the House Democrats will find little that Mueller doesn't already know about.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Ah, I misunderstood you.jarnon wrote:No, Bob, I'm agreeing with you. The speculation is SSS's "that's nothing." I predict that the House Democrats will find little that Mueller doesn't already know about. But there are plenty of House committees and lots of other officials they can investigate: Wilbur Ross, Mulvaney, Mnuchin, Zinke, DeVos, etc.Bob78164 wrote:It's not speculation. It's informed inference based on the docket and other evidence laid out in the article. It may not be right, but I can't think of another plausible explanation for the D.C. Circuit's remarkably quick action with respect to the District Court's order. --Bobjarnon wrote:This is speculation. Mueller is keeping very quiet around election time (unlike some investigators in 2016). But from what we know from before October, he (along with federal and state prosecutors in New York) have already questioned most of Trump's inner circle.
I do suspect House Democrats will find lots to investigate, starting with violations of the Emoluments Clause, that Mueller hasn't looked into because he considers it outside his mandate. --Bob
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Starting with Donny's tax returns. It's about time we found out what he's been hiding. --Bobsilverscreenselect wrote:But they can make a lot of information public that Mueller can't simply by holding public hearings. And that's especially true if Trump tries to get rid of Mueller after the election.jarnon wrote:I predict that the House Democrats will find little that Mueller doesn't already know about.
"Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." Thomas Jefferson
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
You're all wrong. He subpoenaed Hillary.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
This is undoubtedly a different case, since the names involved don't match, but I'm sure Bob will be intrigued:
Supreme Court Blocks Commerce Secretary Questioning In Census Lawsuits, For Now
This line caught my eye, for its hypocrisy and astounding chutzpah:
Supreme Court Blocks Commerce Secretary Questioning In Census Lawsuits, For Now
This line caught my eye, for its hypocrisy and astounding chutzpah:
The administration argues the Justice Department's civil rights division, currently led by Gore, needs the question on citizenship in the census in order to better enforce the Voting Rights Act protections against racial discrimination.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
I find it extremely illogical for the census to NOT ask about citizenship.jarnon wrote:This is undoubtedly a different case, since the names involved don't match, but I'm sure Bob will be intrigued:
Supreme Court Blocks Commerce Secretary Questioning In Census Lawsuits, For Now
This line caught my eye, for its hypocrisy and astounding chutzpah:The administration argues the Justice Department's civil rights division, currently led by Gore, needs the question on citizenship in the census in order to better enforce the Voting Rights Act protections against racial discrimination.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
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War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
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~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Article 1, Section 2 of the Constitution mandates the census in order to apportion the number of representatives for each state (as well as taxation). The 14th Amendment (yes, the same one that grants "birthright citizenship"), Section 2, says that "the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed" are to be counted. It says nothing about counting only citizens.BackInTex wrote:I find it extremely illogical for the census to NOT ask about citizenship.jarnon wrote:This is undoubtedly a different case, since the names involved don't match, but I'm sure Bob will be intrigued:
Supreme Court Blocks Commerce Secretary Questioning In Census Lawsuits, For Now
This line caught my eye, for its hypocrisy and astounding chutzpah:The administration argues the Justice Department's civil rights division, currently led by Gore, needs the question on citizenship in the census in order to better enforce the Voting Rights Act protections against racial discrimination.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
The only rationale in the Constitution for asking more detailed questions about the people living in the US was the provisions about slaves counting 3/5 of a person for the purposes of representation in the House. That went away when slavery was abolished.earendel wrote:Article 1, Section 2 of the Constitution mandates the census in order to apportion the number of representatives for each state (as well as taxation). The 14th Amendment (yes, the same one that grants "birthright citizenship"), Section 2, says that "the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed" are to be counted. It says nothing about counting only citizens.BackInTex wrote:I find it extremely illogical for the census to NOT ask about citizenship.jarnon wrote:This is undoubtedly a different case, since the names involved don't match, but I'm sure Bob will be intrigued:
Supreme Court Blocks Commerce Secretary Questioning In Census Lawsuits, For Now
This line caught my eye, for its hypocrisy and astounding chutzpah:
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Where did I say only count citizens? I did not.earendel wrote:Article 1, Section 2 of the Constitution mandates the census in order to apportion the number of representatives for each state (as well as taxation). The 14th Amendment (yes, the same one that grants "birthright citizenship"), Section 2, says that "the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed" are to be counted. It says nothing about counting only citizens.BackInTex wrote:I find it extremely illogical for the census to NOT ask about citizenship.jarnon wrote:This is undoubtedly a different case, since the names involved don't match, but I'm sure Bob will be intrigued:
Supreme Court Blocks Commerce Secretary Questioning In Census Lawsuits, For Now
This line caught my eye, for its hypocrisy and astounding chutzpah:
Citizenship status is as important, and in my opinion more important, than the other demographic information collected.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)
~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
And the reason for not asking about citizenship is because people are less likely to answer questions accurately if they are essentially being asked to incriminate themselves or a family member.BackInTex wrote: Citizenship status is as important, and in my opinion more important, than the other demographic information collected.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
"Incriminate" implies they've committed crimes. I thought you just considered them "undocumented."silverscreenselect wrote:And the reason for not asking about citizenship is because people are less likely to answer questions accurately if they are essentially being asked to incriminate themselves or a family member.BackInTex wrote: Citizenship status is as important, and in my opinion more important, than the other demographic information collected.
A child of five would understand this. Send someone to fetch a child of five.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
It doesn't matter what I consider them. It matters what the people taking the census, who represent Donald Trump's federal government consider them.Estonut wrote: "Incriminate" implies they've committed crimes. I thought you just considered them "undocumented."
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Silly me. I thought it was the LAW that determined those kinds of things.*silverscreenselect wrote:It doesn't matter what I consider them. It matters what the people taking the census, who represent Donald Trump's federal government consider them.Estonut wrote: "Incriminate" implies they've committed crimes. I thought you just considered them "undocumented."
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
You're right, the law says the folks we call "undocumented" are in our country illegally.flockofseagulls104 wrote:Silly me. I thought it was the LAW that determined those kinds of things.silverscreenselect wrote:It doesn't matter what I consider them. It matters what the people taking the census, who represent Donald Trump's federal government consider them.Estonut wrote: "Incriminate" implies they've committed crimes. I thought you just considered them "undocumented."
The law also says census data can't be shared with other agencies like ICE. But many aliens don't know this, or distrust the federal government as a whole.
The law also says Trump can't exclude whole classes of people from the 14th Amendment, or order troops to shoot foreigners at the border, but Trump still makes these threats, to rally his supporters and annoy the opposition. Until the whole immigration mess is fixed, these political games will go on.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
What law says our military can't defend our borders from an invading force of domestic or foreign people? That would be a pretty stupid law. Serious question.jarnon wrote:You're right, the law says the folks we call "undocumented" are in our country illegally.flockofseagulls104 wrote:Silly me. I thought it was the LAW that determined those kinds of things.silverscreenselect wrote:
It doesn't matter what I consider them. It matters what the people taking the census, who represent Donald Trump's federal government consider them.
The law also says census data can't be shared with other agencies like ICE. But many aliens don't know this, or distrust the federal government as a whole.
The law also says Trump can't exclude whole classes of people from the 14th Amendment, or order troops to shoot foreigners at the border, but Trump still makes these threats, to rally his supporters and annoy the opposition. Until the whole immigration mess is fixed, these political games will go on.
I believe the Coast Guard has done it numerous times.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)
~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
We sent troops into Mexico after Pancho Villa before World War I (with mixed success), but it's ridiculous to consider these families in the caravan as an "invading force." That is unless you're Donald Trump trying to stir up anti-immigrant and anti-Hispanic sentiment as an 11th hour political ploy It's interesting that Republican candidates in battleground states of Nevada and Arizona, who theoretically would be among the most at risk in the event of an actual invasion from the south, asked Trump not to show up in their states for a rally this week.BackInTex wrote:
What law says our military can't defend our borders from an invading force of domestic or foreign people? That would be a pretty stupid law. Serious question.
I believe the Coast Guard has done it numerous times.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
This is what Republicans are afraid of:silverscreenselect wrote:We sent troops into Mexico after Pancho Villa before World War I (with mixed success), but it's ridiculous to consider these families in the caravan as an "invading force."BackInTex wrote:
What law says our military can't defend our borders from an invading force of domestic or foreign people? That would be a pretty stupid law. Serious question.
I believe the Coast Guard has done it numerous times.
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Nope, but you can keep putting your head in the sand and pretend that it is.jarnon wrote:This is what Republicans are afraid of:silverscreenselect wrote:We sent troops into Mexico after Pancho Villa before World War I (with mixed success), but it's ridiculous to consider these families in the caravan as an "invading force."BackInTex wrote:
What law says our military can't defend our borders from an invading force of domestic or foreign people? That would be a pretty stupid law. Serious question.
I believe the Coast Guard has done it numerous times.
..what country can preserve it’s liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms.
~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)
~~ Thomas Jefferson
War is where the government tells you who the bad guy is.
Revolution is when you decide that for yourself.
-- Benjamin Franklin (maybe)
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Re: Mueller Has (Probably) Subpoenaed Donny
Well, that's the view of the Pentagon so I guess we're in good company. --BobBackInTex wrote:Nope, but you can keep putting your head in the sand and pretend that it is.jarnon wrote:This is what Republicans are afraid of:silverscreenselect wrote:
We sent troops into Mexico after Pancho Villa before World War I (with mixed success), but it's ridiculous to consider these families in the caravan as an "invading force."
"Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." Thomas Jefferson